Speaker 1: 0:12

Welcome back to the Practical Spirituality Podcast. We are so excited to have you on this journey with us, where we explore all elements of mind, body, emotions and soul through the lens of everyday life.

Speaker 2: 0:29

Hello Kim.

Speaker 1: 0:30

Hello Gareth, how are you?

Speaker 2: 0:32

I'm doing good this morning. How are you doing?

Speaker 1: 0:34

I'm good.

Speaker 2: 0:35

For this episode. We're going to be talking about old patterns and triggers and different ways to recognize them and how to address them. Very interesting. I feel like you could talk about this in your sleep. I think you could talk about this in your sleep.

Speaker 1: 0:45

I think I could talk about this in my sleep, because this is what I do all day, every day. So I think it's kind of exciting that we're going to talk about something like this yeah.

Speaker 2: 0:56

Well, I think, just to get us started, we should probably go through some definitions, just so that we're all on the same page. So a pattern refers to reoccurring behaviors, thoughts or emotional responses that individuals exhibit over time. These are often habitual and can be either conscious or unconscious. Patterns develop through repeated experiences and practices becoming ingrained in the way we interact with ourselves and the world around us.

Speaker 1: 1:22

Okay.

Speaker 2: 1:23

And for a trigger. Triggers provoke strong emotional or behavioral reactions, often linked to past experiences or unresolved issues. They can be external events or internal thoughts and memories that elicit responses to current situations.

Speaker 1: 1:39

I have a slightly different definition of that, but that's okay, that works. Shocking who would have thought?

Speaker 2: 1:44

Yes, different definition of that, but that's okay, that works.

Speaker 1: 1:47

Shocking. Who would have thought, yes, I think it's such a great topic, gareth, because a lot of people view both the patterns and the triggers as something to be avoided, and we both know we can't avoid these things because they're going to be happening. And a lot of people, when they say they don't know how to recognize them, they just haven't really had the awareness brought to what they actually are and how they show up in their life, like, for example, we talk about the triggers. Every single person I have ever worked with works very hard at stopping the triggers. The problem with that is that the way that the mind works, it files everything based on different stimulus, and that stimulus is the images, the sounds, the sensations, the smells, the taste and the thoughts, and it files it in what I call the filing cabinet of the mind, which is part of the emotional brain, and then it is filed in accordance to the emotional charge at the time of the original event. So what's interesting about that is we go, oh, I'm going to stop that trigger, but if the brain has already been holding it for however many years and you're completely unaware that, that's what's happening, and then when you have a trigger. You don't know what's happening in the trigger, how are you supposed to be able to recognize it? And so that's what I find very interesting.

Speaker 1: 3:15

So those examples that we just gave about what causes a trigger, where the mind gets the information to go uh-oh, red alert, red alert, because that's kind of what the mind does. You can start to pay attention to when that happens. What's interesting, though, that a lot of people don't talk about with triggers, and I can tell you I did so much work on myself therapy, psychotherapy, all of that for years, and not one single person mentioned to me that when the mind picks up one of those stimulus, in 0.007 of a millisecond, your conscious brain, the blood has started to drain from it, you have 73 chemicals rushing through your body, and you are now operating from the emotional space of that original trigger. And so how, then, at 0.007 of a millisecond, which is faster than a conscious thought, are you supposed to have conscious awareness to go oh stop, I'm not going to do this trigger today. It's just not going to happen. Do you know what I mean?

Speaker 1: 4:19

At all and I think that's important, but what can happen is when this is why I love this topic so much when we start looking at the patterns, once we start understanding what those patterns are about, then we can understand what's triggering the patterns, because you find what's driving that particular issue. Whatever you pick up at the time and then with a lot of awareness, if you're meant to or you're working with somebody and I have to stress that because there's not, I don't think there's a single person on the planet that, when they're in an event like that, actually has the ability to be objective and say oh well, let me just have a look at this trigger and pattern, especially not in the beginning. For me, I think this is a very important topic. I would also like to stress if you're new to working on yourself and getting curious about yourself, understand that you're probably going to need someone outside of yourself that is objective. That's going to help you start to recognize some of the patterns. Sure, you'll pull some of them up. Here's an example From the time that I was a teenager till the time I ended my marriage, every man I was in relationship with cheated on me.

Speaker 1: 5:35

What's interesting about that is probably about through the third relationship. I was aware there was a pattern here. Huh, why is it? I keep attracting men that cheat on me Left to my own devices. What do you think I've made it about? There's something wrong with me? That's really not what we want to look at. Of course we think there's something wrong with us, because that is the general consensus when we have any kind of issues going on. But when we can have someone who's objective help us start to understand these patterns, we go okay. So what is it exactly about these men that you're attracted to? And when you start to look at that, you go. Well, at least for me, I was able to go. Oh, I always attract unavailable men, emotionally unavailable men. Okay, so let's look at why am I attracting emotionally unavailable men, do you understand? And so then we can go back and find the original event, where that is, where I've linked love to somebody who's not available. Is that making sense?

Speaker 2: 6:38

Makes a lot of sense, yep.

Speaker 1: 6:40

So, when we talk about these patterns and the triggers, the reason it matters is because it's like a roadmap, and you and I have talked about it before. We want to understand ourselves and so many people go I don't know how, I don't know how, I don't know how. Well, this is the roadmap. When you start to identify what your patterns are and you start to identify what triggers some of those patterns, then you have a key to what you want to get interested in but there's not a day that goes by that we're all not triggered in some way, because I think it's important to look at it that not all triggers are just negative.

Speaker 2: 7:15

You can have positive triggers as well. That's what's basically a response in emotional, physical, behavioral like it happens every single day to us all, and it's only when you start recognizing these triggers for what they are. They need to begin to actually go to someone, as you're saying, and begin to understand the patterns that have happened throughout our entire lives. So it's not until we understand that can we begin making a change or a genuine change in our day-to-day lives. So you can understand why we have such a bad relationship with ourselves. And we we've been speaking about in previous we want everyone to build a relationship with their emotions from the ground up, because what is a trigger? It tends to be more emotional based and physical, and then obviously, behavioral would actually begin. We begin to withdraw from ourselves, withdraw from others, and that makes us want to avoid all of the triggers that are going on. But the triggers are actually there to try to guide us towards the patterns that actually will allow us to make these bigger life changes that we've been wanting for ourselves for so long.

Speaker 1: 8:12

Exactly, exactly and, as you and I have said before.

Speaker 1: 8:16

You know, for many years, especially when I was doing my own work on myself, I truthfully thought a trigger was a bad thing If I was getting triggered because, of course, according to the spiritual concepts I was believing back then, the goal was to never be triggered, to live in peace, to have control of my mind.

Speaker 1: 8:36

That is kind of what I had been taught back then. So, of course, a trigger was a bad thing because there was an emotional response and people didn't understand the emotional response. Most of the time I didn't understand the emotional response, so it felt like a bad thing, but as you and I have discovered and we continue to try and tell people, it's actually a really good thing. It is your mind saying pay attention, pay attention. Here's a part of you that has not processed something that if you can stop, get curious, go inside and actually have a better understanding, if that's what's meant to happen at that moment, then the mind is going to keep pulling the same thing up over and over and over again. But until we do that, that's what the mind will do.

Speaker 2: 9:22

Yep, because if we don't have a good relationship with our emotions, how are we capable to will do? Yep, because if we don't have a good relationship with our emotions, how are we capable to then sit with the triggers? And if we can't understand the question, sit with the triggers. How can we understand the patterns? If you don't understand the patterns, how can you make the changes that we're all striving towards?

Speaker 2: 9:37

What I love about that entire process that we just talked about no matter where you are in the journey, most of that process tends to be outside of our control.

Speaker 2: 9:44

So what I mean by that is that, no matter how much work you do throughout your life, you're always going to be triggered. There's always going to be new discoveries about yourself. Life always likes to get creative in new ways, to show these up in order to allow you to continue to grow. But that's where the curiosity is so important that you want to continue to learn in all these new ways in which these different parts of you appear throughout your entire life, because that is what makes the journey and that's what makes all of us unique. But if you have a negative bias, as you often talk about, towards even wanting to understand these things about yourself, then you can understand how those patterns are going to continue to compound and make your life more difficult as time goes on, and it's easy to put that back onto self-blame and self-loathing and shame and all of those emotions. So you can see how any of us, if not all of us, have got stuck in that loop so many times throughout our lives.

Speaker 1: 10:31

So this is why it's important to talk about it's very important to talk about and, as we've talked about in the different series of the podcast, that I used to often say, you know I'd bang my head against the wall. You know I kept running into the wall because I couldn't make the change. There's different reasons, like you just said. They're going to keep repeating, but it wasn't that I was a slow learner. As much as I like to kid about that, it's not that I wasn't a slow learner. I just hadn't had the awareness yet and or did I have the emotional maturity to be able to understand what that pattern was directing me towards. And once I was ready and that is the magic question everybody wants to know well, how do we know when we're ready, or is it this time? I really want to get through this so that I can just have a smooth sailing. Well, we all do Newsflash. It's not going to happen.

Speaker 1: 11:30

But, like you said, the triggers and some of the patterns are also very positive as well. But we very quickly dismiss those and people want to know why do we dismiss those? And one of the reasons we dismiss those so easily is because the mind does have that negative bias and so it's on high alert for that because it's trying to keep this biological being happening and us on course. So naturally the positive things get dismissed very easily. That doesn't mean that we can't stop and celebrate those, and the more that we do that we can start to see where some of that growth is really kicking in.

Speaker 2: 12:05

But the positive triggers that we experience, I think because we have been accustomed to being allowed to feel those emotions or experience those triggers. We process them at lightning speed compared to the negative triggers that we've all been taught to push away or to pretend that does not exist. So therefore, it's understandable that when a negative trigger appears, we push it down, we avoid it at all costs and often we actually pretend it didn't even happen and or otherwise we blame the other person for bringing that up in us, which is something that we've all done. But I'm sure you see that all the time and we've talked about it as well in the podcast they made me feel this way. They did did this to me because none of us actually understand the mechanics, as you were talking about at the start of this episode, of where these triggers, patterns and behaviors come from within us. So if you don't understand that, how can you expect anyone to take responsibility for it, never mind process it, dissect it, learn from it, and to accept that part of them? That is truly original.

Speaker 1: 13:02

You know. And then the other thing that happens that we haven't mentioned yet is when we've had some of these patterns over and, over and over again. The mind tends to do this looping thing and we don't get out of the loop. And so we think and when I say we, I know I experienced this in the early days of my growth I thought that it has to be me, because it continues to happen. It doesn't seem to be continuing to happen to someone else, and so the more the mind loops on it that proof we start to really believe the lie behind it instead of going wait, this is just trying to show me something to work on here.

Speaker 2: 13:41

And that goes back to the previous episode that we were talking about, or that topic in general of why does our brains fixate on certain things on an ongoing basis? Because we could talk about it spiritually, in the sense of it keeps coming back, because there's things that we're still to learn from it or to understand about self, mind, body, emotions. But what are the different strategies and ways in which we can begin recognizing these patterns and triggers that appear within us all? So where would you like to start in diving into that?

Speaker 1: 14:06

Well, I think when you feel stuck, like when someone is feeling stuck or they keep thinking, the same thing keeps happening to them and they don't understand. That would be the first place. And so when we're stuck usually because it's a painful experience that we're stuck in we are only focusing on the pain instead of saying, okay, when has this happened before? And if I could sit back and just go, let me just make a list of how many times this particular feeling or this type of event that is happening has shown up in my life before type of event that is happening has shown up in my life before. So when I start noticing when it's shown up before, then we can look at what is the theme of it, like the example I gave at the very beginning. Hang on, all these men keep cheating on me.

Speaker 1: 14:57

So what's interesting about that is, yes, I was attracting unavailable men, but I had had an incident happen in early childhood where I believed, whether it was true or not. I believed, that my father was cheating on my mom. Now my dad said he loved my mom very much. He said he loved his family very much. He said he loved me very much. That that child made at the time, or the perception was that well, if you love me, you will cheat on me and then link that in the mind.

Speaker 1: 15:31

So naturally then, as I'm going through life, if that is the belief I hold I must find unavailable people that are going to run this pattern, so that I can prove that belief that I formed true and also positive. That part that I didn't go into about it is where I'm unavailable to myself, and being unavailable to myself means that I also believe that I'm not worthy of someone who's going to be there for me. So that is one of the ways we can start to look at it. That was one of. I brought it up because it was one of the very first patterns I ever noticed in my life and I thought that's very interesting. Why is that happening to me? But you notice, it kept reoccurring until I got curious about it.

Speaker 2: 16:16

Yeah, and because I think there can be those specific events that appear or those patterns you're saying that we can recognize early on in life or as we're going through different relationships and different events. But I think this is where to help people even just think about it from their own circumstances. You know, I ask even my own clients, take a step back, and so when I ask them, okay so what triggers you in life? It's like okay, so what dates, what times of the years are certain things that appear in the calendar? Is it anniversaries? How are you surrounding criticism, rejection, conflict with others, like these basic things that we all experience in a day-to-day, week-to-week, month-to-month basis, that trigger something within us.

Speaker 2: 16:57

And then I ask anybody, it's like do you understand why that triggers you? And often blank for most people. So they're consciously aware that they don't like these things, but and they know that there's more going on behind the scenes in their subconscious. However, as you're saying, those connections haven't been made yet of the why component in mind, body, emotions, of why this is occurring. So that is exactly where the learning is. So I ask people to keep a trigger log, or a trigger book, so to speak, so they begin tracking it, even in the comfort of their own homes. So they begin questioning it over a period of time to start piecing it together, as you were talking about, in a safe way that's not too overwhelming. And with that then you can slowly build with time into the bigger triggers, onto the bigger patterns. But you have to start at the ground floor and work your way up.

Speaker 1: 17:48

I can't agree more with that. And the other thing I think that came up for me while you were talking is with a lot of my clients. They'll have children and when their children reach an age where something had happened to them, it becomes a very big trigger and they find themselves really struggling with different things with their own child, and that is also one of those things that you could write down. Okay, so if you've written down the areas where you get triggered, or times of year you get triggered or events that trigger you, and then so, for example, you have a five-year-old and something happened to you at five and all of a sudden you just can't relate to your five-year-old or there's a disconnect. It's like oh wait a second, what is this about? And can I get curious about that? It doesn't mean you have to dig in and find the exact thing. You just need to notice what's happening for you around your own five-year-old and that will be enough information for you to start to get curious. But if you're not even curious, you just go. For example, you're not even curious, you just go.

Speaker 1: 18:53

For example, I have a family member that has a child and this child reached a certain age and at this age. She just felt like, oh my gosh, I don't know if I can relate to this child anymore. I just thought it was absolutely hilarious because I could see the pattern. And of course she couldn't see the pattern because she's very early on in this the pattern, and of course she couldn't see the pattern because she's very early on in this. And so, as I said to her, what happened to you at that age, and she just kind of eyes got wide and she went, oh, so all you have to do at that point then is get curious about what does it mean for you and what can I learn from this? And what are these emotions trying to show me or help me understand about me, instead of making it about the child? That's what's the important part, I think, when you're starting to recognize them, so keeping a journal and noticing those reoccurring themes when they've happened, like you were just talking about.

Speaker 2: 19:46

Yeah, and I want to be sure know it's not all just negative either. So what? I even find fascinating that when someone says I absolutely love celebrating birthdays, or I love my birthday, I love that person's birthday, it's okay, great. Why? Why is birthday such an amazing thing for you? Where did that start? Or what age were you obsessed with? Or if they love thanksgiving or they love christmas, and. And then someone else says I actually don't have that much time for those events, or they're not a big deal for me or I'm not fond of them. Again, all valid, but the curiosity of understanding why we get, why these emotions get triggered, and what are these patterns and where do they come from. It's just an area of fascination because there's always links to other things in our lives that we don't understand yet.

Speaker 1: 20:25

Yet, and that is that is the key thing.

Speaker 2: 20:28

So when you have those aha moments for those events that we actually do want to talk about and those connections are made, it's amazing the pathway that opens up to talk about some of the more mysterious things about us and our patterns and behaviors that we're still yet to discover, to understand. But when we are trying to build a relationship with those different parts of us, kind of, as you're saying, even about the talking about the child that we are working with our inner child more often than not, as we talked about. So we have to start simply and work our way to understand that a lot of our triggers are coming from our inner child, because a lot of how we perceive the world started at such a young age that no wonder we go zero to a hundred, even in our emotions, because that is the capacity that we're working with. So therefore, we have to simplify it and start small, to educate ourselves, pull the pieces together and then, with time, it comes a lot easier.

Speaker 1: 21:21

Exactly. And the other thing I would like to say is people who are starting this journey and think but I don't want to go to the past. And why do I have to go to the past? Why do I have to understand what was happening in my inner child? One of the best ways I found to explain it is I say to them what kind of operating system are you working on in your computer today? And they will tell me, and I'll go.

Speaker 1: 21:43

Now I want you to imagine if you had the same computer from 1990. And if you had to do the work you're doing today on that old computer from 1990, how easy would it be and how often would that create issues in your life? And they're like oh, I wouldn't even be able to do my work with that. So exactly when we're young and we pick up some of these events and beliefs and things that have happened, and they get solidified, and here we are, all these years later, the trigger happens and we're still using the same coping mechanisms that were initiated in that early childhood. Of course it's not going to give us the results that we are hoping for, and until we can understand that, we can't upgrade the computer of our mind or our body or our emotions in order to move forward. The mind and the body and the emotions are going to continue to keep repeating it going. Could you please upgrade? And using that analogy seems to really help people understand. Oh, it's not a bad thing, I'm just learning and upgrading.

Speaker 2: 22:48

Absolutely thing. I'm just learning and upgrading Absolutely and. But this is where, even when it comes to those patterns that keep repeating, as you're saying there, as we've talked about before, what I've never found to work all that well is that, say, if there is these negative behaviors, patterns, triggers are constantly repeating, throwing positivity at it is not the answer Right. So what I mean by that is that does it have its time and place in our lives and in different strategies to help us? Yes, but is it the full answer? No, because these negative patterns, behaviors, triggers, they're not necessarily the problem, they're just seeking to be understood. So we have to approach it from a neutral stance of not trying to get rid of it, not trying to fight it, not trying to delete it. It is there to be understood. And the difference to talking to a child screaming at the child does not help. Using big words does not help the child. You have to have patience and approach it in the best way you can, but it does take time.

Speaker 1: 23:46

That's a very fair statement and I think, like I just had a client say to me the other day, I just have to learn how to control my mind. I'm like, yeah, no, that's not going to work. But what I do want you to do is take a moment and understand what this means for you, understand what is it trying to show you and where can you have compassion for you?

Speaker 2: 24:14

Let's take a step back from this week's episode and share with everyone what we've been up to behind the scenes.

Speaker 1: 24:19

We're really excited to be able to finally offer the Gareth Michael community to each of you offers a range of benefits, including access to our live events, weekly podcast episodes, articles, self-checking questions, as well as a community of individuals you can connect with and interact with along the way. It's designed to offer you support, guidance and a safe space on a day-to-day basis. We'd love to have you join our global community of like-minded individuals. We'd love to have you join our global community of like-minded individuals. That website address again is wwwgarethmichaelcom.

Speaker 2: 24:58

Now let's get back to that episode, shall we? I remember saying to clients before is that there's no love in control. So any part of you that's trying to control different parts of yourself, the outcome is never going to be as positive as you think it's going to be. So if you're trying to say, if I control that part of me, then I'll be happy, it's like when has control and happy ever been in the same sentence or ever truly worked long term for any person?

Speaker 2: 25:21

So this is why people need to understand in what ways they're approaching it and actually think is this actually going to give me the result that I think it will, because there is no shortcut to this. But at the same time, people are only looking for shortcuts because they actually are not fully educated on all the work that's actually needed or the step-by-step ways of how do we begin to identify this and what does that mean for our growth longer term. So once again, I remember starting. You know, starting my journey and going through this and working on these different parts of me. It was mind blowing of how little information there actually is out there on all of this, yet it's something that we all go through every single day.

Speaker 1: 26:01

That is what I have found fascinating and that is one of the reasons I even do what I do because of my own journey and how difficult it was to start to understand, to have any clear understanding of what was happening and, in fact, what I found in the early days, which I think it's changed a lot these days. But in the early days I was even shamed more for the reactions that I was having. I was shamed because I didn't have the positive thoughts. I was shamed because I was still getting triggered. I was shamed because I didn't have the ability to affect, you know, to regulate my emotions, and so, of course, that, how helpful is that? And, like you were saying about the positive, because the mind is negative bias and because that gets processed very quickly, we dismiss it very quickly as well. And so someone will say to me it's easy for you to say because things come easily for you and I can't ever seem to get anything. So I like to then go and this is one of the processes I use if people are stuck in a negative mindset of this sort of thing how many things have you succeeded at? This was one of the greatest exercises a personal development workshop gave me. We had to sit down and write down how many things we successfully navigated.

Speaker 1: 27:21

Now a lot of people will start with but I haven't ever been successful. But when we talk about oh wait a minute, when you were born, you didn't know how to speak. You learned how to speak, you learned how to eat, you learned how to feed yourself, you learned how to tie your shoes, you learned how to ride a bike, you learned how to read, you learned how to do this and you start to look at all of that. There've been far more positives than there really are negatives, but we dismiss those and that is why that bias sits on that negative side and why we think these negative patterns are the ones that are the problems.

Speaker 1: 27:55

But if we could focus on some of those positive triggers and patterns and really identify where we have been successful, then processing that allows us to use that positivity, that type of positivity with some of the negative patterns. Okay, well, if I can successfully navigate all of this now, I can successfully start to understand what this negative pattern is about. Now. When I worked at the drug and alcohol rehabs, one of the things I loved to do and my coworkers thought I was insane love to do and my coworkers thought I was insane is someone would have a bust or a slip they'd pick up and use again. They'd come back into the rehab and I would sit them down and I'd go okay, let's do an autopsy.

Speaker 2: 28:39

And they're like what?

Speaker 1: 28:40

And I'm like, because very rarely does a bust happen when you actually picked up the drink. There's been a trigger somewhere before and our job is to backtrack and figure out where that part of you got triggered that your mind said hang on, we need to find a self-medication process for lack of a better way of saying it which is the slip or the bust. My coworkers thought it was crazy because trying to go back and identify the trigger, trying to go back and identify the trigger, but usually you can rarely, rarely, rarely, rarely recognize the trigger until you've done a whole lot of work on yourself. In present time, it's usually in hindsight when you first start, and so I want to give everybody that permission to go. Okay, I got triggered, I had a reaction, whether it was positive or negative. After the reaction has finished, now let me sit down and go.

Speaker 1: 29:31

Where did that actually start? When did I lose, for lack of saying anything else, lose control, because that's usually how people identify. It is that they've lost control and they've done or said something that they weren't proud of, you know, or had a reaction that they didn't want to have. So when you can start to do that, you keep a journal and then, as we always say hopefully you have someone objective, that is professional, that is well-versed, and that you get along with that. You can take these journals to and they can then help you start to get curious, understand what these patterns mean for you, help you understand where you've linked them or what the belief systems are, or what perception you're supposed to, not supposed to, what the curiosity is meant to have for you to learn from that particular and I think the tough thing, though, about becoming aware of these different things is sometimes the changes that are inevitably going to come along after you become aware of them.

Speaker 2: 30:34

So there is often some difficult decisions that we have to make, and let that be moving on from some relationships that maybe aren't direct for us anymore or, yes, we can take ownership and responsibility for the triggers that are going on within us, but Even after doing that, if you're in a relationship that's constantly triggering you and the other person's not taking responsibility for their part in it, no matter how much work you do on yourself, sound familiar.

Speaker 2: 30:58

No, at all, it's important to understand that you can go to work on yourself, but sometimes external changes are also necessary as you develop an internal relationship with self.

Speaker 1: 31:20

And that will trigger new responses, even in itself. Exactly, it brings up a whole new set. You know and we were laughing because one of the key things that Gareth and I always talk about is at the end of my marriage. You know, I had done so much work on myself and I truthfully believed at that time that if I did all this work, that the marriage would work out. The other person wasn't meant to, and the beautiful part about it and we often talk about sacred contracts is when that marriage dissolved I was able to see what the contract with that person was, and then all the bitterness and the anger left.

Speaker 1: 31:53

The new set of circumstances it brought up was oh, now I get to discover how little I believe in myself or how little I believe I can survive in the world on my own. Those were some of the things that started to come up for me. So just because we resolve one thing doesn't mean we're going to have easy street, and I think that's a misconception that a lot of spiritual growth and personal development put out there, that you're going to get to a place where you're going to live in this, you know, peaceful place. The difference, I would say for me, with all the work that I've done is I'm more content within myself. Have the trigger stopped? No, but my reaction to triggers and patterns has completely changed, and so therefore, it's not as dramatic of an effect that it used to be.

Speaker 2: 32:44

And I do want to dive into something that you had actually mentioned earlier, because I hear this all the time with some of the clients I work with you keep attracting the similar kind of men into your life. So you would often hear in the spiritual world isn't like the law of attraction? Like why do I keep manifesting or attracting the same kind of people into my life? I must be doing something wrong or I'm creating this, yeah, I'm creating this or what am.

Speaker 2: 33:05

What am I really? Am I really putting that crap energy out into the universe? Is this really what I'm attracting back? What? What's your understanding of that? When it comes to when people, as you say, attract that kind of, those kind of individuals into your life, what do you think that's down to?

Speaker 1: 33:21

At a young age, I had an experience and there was a belief that was formed. I didn't understand that the belief probably wasn't the most beneficial belief for me to have formed. I think I continued to be attracted to men that ran that particular pattern, because I didn't understand at that first point what that was all about. So when I see it now, when I see the patterns now, I don't go, oh, I've created this, I, oh, this is happening, because I still haven't understood something, I haven't gained the wisdom from this particular type of event, that event in this case being men that were not faithful to me. And so it's loaded. It's never just one thing. It'd be too simple to say it's one thing because with all of them there's so many different awarenesses that, as you have the ability to get curious and also the emotional maturity.

Speaker 1: 34:21

Because in the beginning I did believe the law of attraction, I did think, oh, I'm creating this, I just like players is what I used to say to myself. Players is what I used to say to myself. They're usually good looking and, yes, I did like that. But that, unfortunately, podcast exclusive. That unfortunately, was not really what the case was. I think the case was the fact that I had a misconception at an early age about what love was, what it represented. My mind latched onto that and I continued to do that, and what I eventually learned is I didn't understand how to love me and I didn't. I mean, it's so multifaceted. There were so many lessons in it, but it is about understanding why these patterns are creating not I created it.

Speaker 2: 35:14

But this is why I wanted to bring it up again, because I think people, especially when they're starting their journey or getting really into the energy and the spiritual part of stuff, it's that they feel like if they just say the affirmations, the mantras, they show a lot of the bionic crystals, you know that they'll stop attracting a certain type of person into our lives.

Speaker 2: 35:32

But, as we both know, when it comes to spiritual journey, it's about your growth in mind, body, emotion, soul and the lessons in it for you. So, unless you're going to go and do the work, as you mentioned, that you had to do for yourself, then we're going to naturally keep attracting, so to speak, those individuals into our life. And you can say, of course they're part of your spiritual contract because they're going to keep appearing. What you resist, persists, which you don't understand, keeps coming back into your life and repeats. That's, of course, true. But this is where, no matter how many chakra cleanses you get or how much seed you burn in your home, it's not going to stop those patterns and behaviors. Because that's where doing the hard yards and doing the work and understanding and build a relationship with self is the real key to changing those behaviors and patterns, understanding them at its core in day-to-day life.

Speaker 1: 36:19

Agreed, 100% agreed. It's such a process, though and that is what I think is difficult for people to hear because we have been conditioned for the quick fix. I mean, that's just the way the whole personal development, spiritual growth community has been for so long, and so saying that it's multifaceted and that you're going to have different levels of understanding at different times, a lot of people don't really necessarily want to hear that, but they need to hear that because that way it stops you from you know that always blaming self, shaming yourself over and over and over again because I didn't get it or I haven't understood it yet. It's always comes in layers, and so understanding that gives you the ability to have more compassion for yourself as these patterns are showing up. When you're recognizing them, it isn't about oh, I've recognized a pattern, that's it, it's going to be over. That's not necessarily how it works.

Speaker 1: 37:22

Every single one of these things has something to show us about us. Until we actually integrate that and have a better understanding of that, they will continue to roll, and even after you have an understanding, it still happens, but it's not at the same degree. It's a completely different degree that it happens at, and so, in my language and I get given grief all the time for saying this what was the gift? And I get given grief all the time for saying this what was the gift? People, I hate that, but there is a gift in it in awareness of yourself if you think about it. So now I often say what was the wisdom? I still say gift. People give me hell, but that's okay.

Speaker 2: 38:06

It's like when I say I love negative emotions and you give me a dirty look. That's right, that's exactly it.

Speaker 1: 38:13

That's exactly the same response. When I talk about a trigger. I want them to understand in the beginning. What happens is that 0.007 of a millisecond the mind is in reaction and things are coming out of your mouth that you don't understand why you're saying them and you go. I don't know who that person is that just said that or why I said it the way I said it, and you have no ability to stop it in the beginning. If you're not aware of it, then as your awareness grows you might have that trigger and that response happens and you get halfway through that response and you know you're in a trigger but you still can't stop it. It still just rolls right on through. The more work you do, the more understanding you gain. You'll get to a point where the trigger will happen. You're aware the trigger's happening. It still starts out of the gate, just like it always did, but you might be able to stop it halfway through because now you're starting to have a better understanding and you can stop and you can pause.

Speaker 1: 39:09

One of the goals for me had been especially when the triggers were happening, is when I recognize a trigger now and I have enough awareness now, as soon as that sensation hits my body, I go okay, deep breath in, just take a pause. I'm just going to pause and be present with me. There's a reaction. Right, I just acknowledge it. There's a reaction and just in the acknowledging of it sometimes brings the reaction down by half, doesn't mean you're not going to react in the same way, no. But now you are engaging with you in that process, in that pause. Just taking that moment sometimes is enough to bring that part of your mind back online. That's been taken off with the five flight freeze response. That pause, not in the beginning. Just really want to reiterate that it comes after you've been practicing becoming aware for a while.

Speaker 2: 40:09

But that pause makes a big difference and, as we're talking about earlier, also having that log or having that diary or journaling about it is a whole new way to actually express it and to actually see it for yourself with your own eyes.

Speaker 2: 40:24

And this validation in so many ways that we've never been taught how to give ourselves, either because we spent our entire lives pushing it away, saying it wasn't regular, wasn't as bad as we think it was, or but again, that only ever continues to repeat or build anxiety or stress within our systems that appear in a lot of different ways in our day-to-day lives.

Speaker 2: 40:42

It's important to take that moment, to take a step back to breathe, to validate and to seek support, as you were talking about earlier, in different ways to get a different understanding of what's going on within us, because most of us live such busy, chaotic, day-to-day, week-to-week lives that it's very hard for us to get a different understanding outside of ourselves, no matter how much we read or how much we listen online. We need someone at times to be able to question us in ways to open up our minds in different opportunities, and I do love and I do believe in that saying is that when the student is ready, the teacher appears and that goes back to the spiritual contract as well, is that when we're when we're ready to actually start working on these particular patterns triggers, behaviors, the support will always come in the most mysterious of ways of times, when we least expect it.

Speaker 1: 41:32

I agree with that. I do agree with that, and I think you know even just the process of becoming aware of your trigger. That takes quite a while because it is such an instantaneous response in the body that give yourself permission and have those small goals. Okay, I got triggered. I just want to go back and understand what that was about. And you might not gain all that understanding straight away, but chunking it down into these little things, the more that you do that then each time, if you take that moment afterwards to go okay, so when did that happen before? And what does it really mean to me? My reaction, their reaction, writing that down and taking that to whoever's helping you with it, because those are the clues that you're looking for and, as I say to so many people, for me it's like becoming a detective. I want to put on my little Sherlock Holmes cap and get in there and find out what's going on for Kim.

Speaker 2: 42:31

Absolutely, and we're building a relationship with ourselves in ways we've never done it before, like, I think, people's expectations, because everything in today's world is so instant. All of the time and the worst to me it's like you're dating yourself, you don't jump straight to marriage, then divorce, and then it's kind of like we have to date ourselves and go and take our time with the process.

Speaker 2: 42:53

To me, that's what makes the most sense and that's how we begin understanding, recognizing and addressing the patterns, triggers and behaviors that we all have had for a very long time, we all have currently in present day and we're always going to have moving forward, and that's why we need to build a relationship with it.

Speaker 1: 43:11

It's true, it's not as daunting as we all think and as you were using the marriage analogy, you know, I think in the beginning, before we start to understand ourselves, we go straight to divorce. At least I did. Like I was divorcing myself by the time I was eight years of age. Like I was like I don't want to know this person. So we spent a lifetime of divorcing ourself and now it's about okay, wait a minute, Maybe I need to come back and make friends with this person.

Speaker 2: 43:38

I think starting small and even a task for everyone listening could do if they have a moment, is to get a piece of paper or do it on your notes, up on your phone and actually consciously ask yourself what triggers are you aware of and, as we're talking about at the start of this episode, even going back, is there specific sounds, smells, visuals, songs, sense, different things that actually trigger you, let it be positive or negatively.

Speaker 2: 44:02

Or is there a stressful situations from the past or just public speaking or crowded places bring up certain emotions in you or certain negative thoughts? Criticism, rejection, rejection, conflict, any of these things? I think when we take the time just to start at the basics and begin asking why and even if it is anniversaries, dates, times of the year, as we were talking about, birthdays, christmases, thanksgivings, all of that it really starts to open up. Oh wow, I actually don't know where that comes from and, as we've talked about so often, it's just that curiosity to get to know ourselves better, because the expectations that we put on ourselves to have an amazing life that's always so positive and so happy, yet there's so many parts of us in day-to-day that's still such a mystery to ourselves. That's where we need to begin to actually start asking the questions and being patient, and with time the answers will appear. Asking the questions and being patient, and with time, the answers will appear Exactly.

Speaker 1: 44:57

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